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krayvis
*applause*

just because it has 46 human chromosomes doesn't make it a living, breathing organism with rights to a life that may bring about misery...

*contemplates more applause*

There is NOTHING lost. In fact, if you donate the bundle of stem cells, there is something positive going on!

[contemplates a specific organization to give stem cells to the needy...]

why can't genetic engineers work to grow stem cells from a petri dish... huh.gif
YamiBattousai
Maybe they've tried but failed...
Blitzkreig
look Kray they are prettymuch doing that my mom works in the stem cell buissness.
Sharkface217
QUOTE (Blitzkreig @ Jun 2 2004, 07:28 PM)
look Kray they are prettymuch doing that my mom works in the stem cell buissness.

Ya, they can, but didnt Bush pass that law on something about stem cells (he went both ways, making both sides unhappy). Isnt that illegal or something?
krayvis
Bush is stupid

if he gave everyone a million dollars to let him do what he wants, no one would take the money...

ANYONE ANTIABORTION SPEAK OR FOREVER HOLD YOUR SILENCE...1...2...3...etc.

Sharkface217
Im not really anti-abortion, the concept is just "chilling" to me. Im not decided on the issue...........
Blitzkreig
dont waste raw materials thats my beef
Sharkface217
What that have to do with abortion (I already know, but a 7-word run-on sentence is not enough to confirm my suspitions............)?
MiKe EaTs FoOd
i'm definitely antiabortion and i already told my views but everybody obviously disagrees...

it's a human being from conception, period....and the killing of a human being is illegal, so abortion to be too....that's the basis of my belief....and i don't care if u say it's not a human or it doens't feel until it develops it's neurons....

whatever...i'm anti-abortion and i'm stickin with it
Blitzkreig
what about fallopian pregnancys are you against the abortin of those?
Sharkface217
QUOTE (Blitzkreig @ Jun 10 2004, 12:42 PM)
what about fallopian pregnancys are you against the abortin of those?

What is that?
Blitzkreig
when a baby is developing in the fallopian tubes
BloodyStupid
Yes, its very rare but if there is no abortion then both fetus and mother will die.

By the way, Mikeeatsfood, you say killing humans is illegal? How come it's not illegal when we're killing them in war? Technically if a soldier kills someone, he's a person who has committed murder in the first degree. But our government overlooks that, don't they? So killing people is not always illegal.

Just a side note.
Sharkface217
double post..............................


Oh, thanx Blitz
krayvis
What is bad about abortion that makes it controvertial?
please enlighten my very unyeilding standpoint...
Blitzkreig
dry.gifIt is supossedly killing a human life dry.gif
Sharkface217
Ya, people dont understand that there are other ways to kill babies before they are born (war).
MiKe EaTs FoOd
QUOTE (BloodyStupid @ Jun 11 2004, 01:04 PM)
Yes, its very rare but if there is no abortion then both fetus and mother will die.

By the way, Mikeeatsfood, you say killing humans is illegal? How come it's not illegal when we're killing them in war? Technically if a soldier kills someone, he's a person who has committed murder in the first degree. But our government overlooks that, don't they? So killing people is not always illegal.

Just a side note.

omg your so annoying ur like a politician or something...this is supposed to be opinion not prove everybody wrong based on little loop holes whether you agree with it or not...am i wrong? well watever i guess it doesn't really make a difference anymore......sorry i don't really like this forum and i dont' know why i post in it...it just gets me pissed off.......

anyway...i don't agree with war either so it all evens out in my book......

as for fallopian pregnancies: if that's the way it happened, it was obviously meant to be....people probly only get that if fate is trying to save them from something really bad happening to them.......it's like getting it by a bus that "came out of no where" or something....well, no, that just's stupidity....but still....i don't think we should interfere with human life like that at all, just friggin leave everything alone! that's how i feel
Blitzkreig
you wont be saying when you have a curarable desease of some sort. youll say cure me now! no wheter you like it or not there is free will i dk what happed to you to make you think that 2 should die instead of 1 but you better get fixed fast tongue.gif
Rigoletto
anyone who is interested in the Abortion question, as you all seem to be here, should read the manga "Kodocha" by Miho Obana. It's.... I won't give anything away, and for the first 6 or 7 books you won't get it at all, not to mention it's very girly and you guys seem to be very.... male, but still it completely changed my mind about abortion. Completely.

I'm not saying which side I started or ended on =^..^=
MiKe EaTs FoOd
QUOTE (Blitzkreig @ Jun 13 2004, 09:16 PM)
you wont be saying when you have a curarable desease of some sort. youll say cure me now! no wheter you like it or not there is free will i dk what happed to you to make you think that 2 should die instead of 1 but you better get fixed fast tongue.gif

wow i'm sorry but i didn't understand that very well......i think u said something about free will......but yea i believe in free will but i also believe in using it for the wrong reasons.....and i also have my own belief on what are wrong ways to use your free will...

as for the 2 should die instead of 1.....i already explained it....if that is nature's way that the pregnancy go wrong, then they must've deserved it somehow....or something.......we shouldn't interfere or change what happens in life...even if we think it's for the better....we should simply try and help it move along......



hey listen....i don't know if im allowed to do this so i'm gonna ask permission before i do...there's this movie on abortion called The Harder Truth made by The Center For Bio-Ethical Reform......and it actually depicts abortions happening and it shows aborted fetuses and babies....and compares their size to dimes and stuff....and it's really really gross but its what happens....it's just really bloody and graphic....but it's how it happens.............

NIGHTSHIFT OR VOTECCOW: if i may post a link to it, then PLEASE give me the okay...

seriously this thing is powerful....and i suggest greatly that you view it....i'll even give u the warning thing that is shown at the beginning of the video....

"The video which follows will be extremely disturbing to anyone with a mature sense of right and wrong. It graphically depicts abortions and the fetal remains of babies who have been killed by these procedures. One segment is viewed through an optical device which permits video taping of a baby's face while he is actually inside his mother's uterus. You will recognize this scene when a flashing triangle appears.

Although you will see aborted babies from all three trimesters of pregnancy, many are second and third trimester in age. Most of the latter were taken from garbage bags removed from a dumpster behind an abortion clinic. Pro-abortion activists often complain that pictures of older babies misrepresent the reality of abortion. But according to the Centers For Disease Control, approximately 10% of all abortions are performed in the second trimester and in some years that figure has amounted to 160,000 abortions. Even more shockingly, some .8% of all abortions occur after the 21st week of gestation, by which time a baby begins to have a change of survival outside the uterus. That means approximately 15,000 times in some years, the babies being killed are the same ages as those of pre-maturely born infants being treated in the neo-natal care units of many hospitals. And they are often being aborted because their parents suspect that they might be less healthy, or intelligent, or attractive than had been hoped.

If you don't wish to watch this tape then we don't want you to see it. If you don't wish to call attention to yourself by leaving we invite you to simply look away from the screen. As a gesture of respect for those who choose not to watch, this tape contains no narration and the muscial score is instrumental (without lyrics). We don't even want you to hear anything you don't want to hear.

But we obviously hope you will watch because the word abortion has lost almost all of its meaning. Until you've seen it, you can't possibly understand it. Until you understand it, you're unlikely to feel an appropriate sense of outrage. And without genuine indignation, people seldom assume personal responsibility for ending injustice.

Mother Theresa was once quoted as saying that abortion is the use of violence to get what we want. A well known political figure recently observed that the trouble with America is that we are losing our sense of shame. This tape demonstrates just how right they both are."

the movie is 6.38MB and is 9 minutes long, but a little over 3 minutes of it is just the warning...cuz its so long......but seriously, if you don't puke, cry, or get seriously freaked out when seeing blood or exceedingly disturbing images....i hope you watch it........this thing makes me cry every time i do as much as start listening to the beginning music....and i can't put enough emphasis on how much i hope it effects you too....
The_Nightshift
I'd prefer if you just gave the link to anyone who PMs you asking for it. That way, no one is disturbed without consenting to it first (its pretty easy to click a link accidentally, too easy IMHO)
krayvis
watching any part of abortion is sad but abortion can still be good, we just need to set a limit to who should get an abortion, like the administering of human growth hormone
Sharkface217
I think there should be a Minority Report type Abortion. See the future, then kill it.
Blitzkreig
whene you find three semi veges that can tell the future you come tell me and we will make a precrime report machine
Sharkface217
Ahhh, but it is possible to change the future if you know the outcome, correct? We are getting off topic.........


Abortion, like many other things in life, is a gamble. You win or you (and the baby) lose(s).
Blitzkreig
a very predictable gamble....
Tracidini
get off it, i can't stand males talking about abortion. They don't know what it's like...sure you PMS and all that stuff but it's not the same. You still have no right to decide.
Blitzkreig
what so now you have a right to tell us what we can and cant do. this is a free topic so if you are soooo partial to us talking about it thene solve it your self. im sorry but that is not how things work here...
The_Nightshift
no gender war here please...although the final decision is individual I see no reason why it cannot be discussed equally by both genders
Moril
I agree with Tracidini that we males shouldn't decide whether or not abortion should be legal. If we aren't capable of experiencing it, why should we make the laws that determine whether it should be done?

However, it is an interesting topic for discussion by both sexes, as long as it does not become too ridiculous (Sharkface... that was bit over the top).
krayvis
I hate to think... I don't think of some human cells as a human life... I feel that there should be a line between cells and developing life, i.e. cell specialization... makes everything more simple...
Blitzkreig
Look tracidni and moril males contribute to half the child if they dont have a say than why dont we just go back to those old colonial fays where no one could do any thing EQUAL RIGHTS. not only was that soooo oprah but seriously what makes you think that as a contraceptive techneiuch we want some one probing our happy sack and cutting the life lines? so in conclusion or this rant WHAT EVER!
The_Nightshift
Blitz, think of it this way: we may be able to discuss it, but we can't exactly be confronted with it in the same mannar...so while I fell we should be free to discuss it we should not be stating that we should have the final authority on the decision

end counterrant
Sharkface217
QUOTE(The_Nightshift @ Jun 25 2004, 11:15 PM)
Blitz, think of it this way: we may be able to discuss it, but we can't exactly be confronted with it in the same mannar...so while I fell we should be free to discuss it we should not be stating that we should have the final authority on the decision

end counterrant
*




Ooo, rants and counter rants, girls vs boys, and a minor refences to me in between! I love this!!!!!


Err, have you guys read "The Bear and The Dragon" by Tom Clancy? Or searched the web for "Chinese Baby (aborted) soup?" Go on the Internet and search for: "Chinese population control methods"

That is worse than late abortions. It is murder.
The_Nightshift
Good point. However, I think this topic was created to discuss abortion as a choice in the free world. If you're especially interested in hearing other's opinions on China's very contraversial population control methods, start a new topic (might just do that myself, seems like one that'll get some good responces).
Sharkface217
Oh....


Well, I searched the web for Chinese Baby soup, and it is worse than goatsee.com and tubgirls and all that other stuff. I feel really bad.
Nirvana
eh... just make condoms that work and we wouldn't have to abort anything...
Blitzkreig
Eczacty well what ever your opinion you can be sure it will be argued upon... any way so lets get off the topic of those "Gross" sites I do beleive that perhaps that should be illeagall because it is disrespectful to the person and those who mourn there loss. (Here come the "Why do we care? They are dead, they cant do anything about it" s) but honestly would you want to be rememberd as "the guy on rotten.com who boiled himself alive in his hot tub"?
Nirvana
no i would rather be theguy who is remeberd for jumping into a pit of starving jelatonus things and being eaten alive...
Sharkface217
But really people, how can someone go around aborting babies just because it will hurt their reputation/family/physical body. That is the one that really gives me the red arse. I mean, stopping a life just so that you won't look fat?


People now days think so backwards.......
Blitzkreig
admittedly some times abortion is unwarrented but it is still there choice i mean if they just dont want a baby give it to an orphanange. but still abortion is just fine with me
krayvis
orphanages should still not be taken as an excuse to procreate without thought to the consequences, they aren't the best of solutions...
Sharkface217
I would like to point out that if all states had "baby centers" like NJ, Abortion could be "safely" made illegal and the babies would live and everyone would be happy.
Blitzkreig
abortion can never should never and will never be illeagl first some people need it second you dont get mmoney when having a baby or giving it to a baby center. you lose mony with almost every option
Sharkface217
I would like to point out that this stuff wouldn't even been thought about in the early 80s. I mean, how backwards could people be today. Abortions don't invent anything or make the world better/worse. They're just jelly in a jar.
Blitzkreig
I would like to introduce you to RUSTY COAT HANGERS!!!
Sharkface217
QUOTE(Blitzkreig @ Sep 7 2004, 03:58 PM)
I would like to introduce you to RUSTY COAT HANGERS!!!
*




?
Blitzkreig
do i really have to explain my self blink.gif
i really dont want to for fear of being exiled for sheer grossness... any one who wants me to tell them please pm me
Sharkface217
OFF TOPIC!!!!


ON TOPIC: Today it is murder. Yesterday it was abortion.
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